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Forcing Concealed Carry Reform

It’s kind of funny this subject came up, because I was exchanging some e-mails with Clayton Cramer just a few days ago where he speculated that we were likely going to get open carry as a constitutionally protected form of carry, which raised more speculation that development would make all the current opponents of concealed carry reform change their tune very quickly. Looks like we already have a convert. This would seem to show there’s value in open carry activism aimed at prodding officials into backing concealed carry reform.

UPDATE: Someone in the comments points out we’re not really looking at a convert, but someone looking to deal. That’s an accurate characterization, I believe. I would not suggest we take him up on it, but it’s interesting he’s willing to talk about it after it’s been made clear by the Wisconsin Courts he can’t do anything about open carry.

14 Responses to “Forcing Concealed Carry Reform”

  1. Mike w. says:

    I’m all for that as long as they’re not simultaneously going to make OC illegal.

  2. Sebastian says:

    In the case of Wisconsin, they can’t, because it’s constitutionally protected.

  3. Kristopher says:

    It worked in Oklahoma.

    The legislature was balking on CCW legislation … when someone pointed out that OC was perfectly legal, even in state buildings.

    Protestors started to OC … and some republican legislators even started OC during the session in question.

    The CCW legislation was quickly forced through … heh.

  4. Peter says:

    I’m not sure what article you’ve read, but the one that I saw made it clear that this statist thug is no sort of convert.

    He wants to trade. If the residents will submit to background checks on all gun sales, then he’ll bend a bit.

  5. Sebastian says:

    Updated with a clarification.

  6. Sebastian says:

    One of the stages of denial is bargaining :) Perhaps we’ll move to acceptance eventually.

  7. Melancton Smith says:

    Looks like IL will be last then. We don’t have legal OC and no State Constitutional protection for RKBA.

  8. Matthew Carberry says:

    Has anyone just started publically (and often) asking if:

    A) the Chief believes his officers are less competent than police officers in 48 other states in being able to deal with a legally armed citizenry

    -or-

    B) he believes the people of Wisconsin are more prone to violence and stupidity and thus less trustworthy with weapons than the people of 48 other states?

    Logically, those are his only two options to support his concerns. So, which one is it Chief?

  9. RAH says:

    This gun controller has been stymied on OC with them losing cases in court. So he is now willing to accept CCW since that can be heavily regulated.

    I agree with Clayton that OC is the default Constitutional provision and I prefer that. CC used to be socially unacceptable because it was sneaky.

    I want the ability to carry either concealed or open without a permit process.

  10. M Gallo says:

    I would like to point out that this is not yet settled law in WI, Sebastian. There are several lawsuits pending, but Brad Krause (West Allis) has been told by local police they WILL arrest him again, and both Milwaukee and Madison police departments have made it clear they will ignore the AG’s opinion on the matter.

    We’re getting there, but but the path still has pitfalls. Anyone in WI OC’ing still has a good chance of getting harrassed and/or arrested, which is an untenable situation.

  11. M Gallo says:

    Incidentally, that’s what the Wisconsin Patriots’ mission is; to use the legality of OC to force comprehensive carry legislation, where you would have permitted CC and constitutionally protected OC (no training or permits).

  12. Melancton Smith says:

    I think OC activists in WI are uniquely situated for civil disobedience that could have great positive consequences and limited downside.

    The downside is limited because they have the State’s AG on their side, limiting their exposure to arrest to only non-felonies.

    Compare that to an OC activist in IL who would face State charges for aggravated UUW, a beefy felony which would result in a lifetime Federal firearm ownership ban. Don’t try this at home.

  13. Sebastian says:

    I have no problem with what OC people are doing in Wisconsin. Using OC as a means to pass comprehensive reform is a reasonable tactic. The main reason I question it in PA is because it’s legal here already.

  14. Melancton Smith says:

    Sebastian: Agreed.

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