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Family Friend

Turns out Bill Ayers is pretty familiar with Obama after all.  You know, I’ve been saying that I don’t think people have to worry about Obama shipping anyone off to concentration camps in cattle cars.  I still stand by that, because I think Obama is hiring and appointing solid progressives, within our legal traditions, not murderers.  But you know, it’s kind of hard to be credible when one of your “family friends” actually has, you know, advocated putting Americans into cattle cars and shipping them off to concentration camps.  I can’t blame people for going off the deep end if Obama is the one pushing them.

24 Responses to “Family Friend”

  1. Robb Allen says:

    I don’t have as much faith as you do that Obama is going to follow the laws set forth to limit the power of the President. The reason is not just Obama and his past record that indicates he would try to over reach, but those who follow him like he’s some sort of holy man, worthy of genuflection at the mere mention of his name.

    Those people will not fight against his excesses. I’ve watched for 8 years as staunch Republicans argue against the abuses of power from Bush, I don’t think we’ll see that with Obama from his supporters.

    Cattle cars? I guess self selection has me not reading that kind of crap.

  2. Sebastian says:

    I think he’s going to overreach, but the comparisons to nazis that have been made are inapt. He might lay groundwork for some future horror, and because of that I think we need to fight him like our future depends on it (which it does).

  3. Mike w. says:

    Well that settles it! Obama is now prohibited, per his rules, from serving in his own administration.

    What am I talking about!?……those rules are for “other people.”

  4. oldblinddog says:

    Solid progressives? Do you even know what a “solid progressive” is? From your comments over the last few weeks it doesn’t appear that you do.

  5. oldblinddog says:

    No, it’s not. More like here.

  6. Sebastian says:

    Wasn’t I mentioning liberal fascism the other day?

  7. mariner says:

    Sebastian said:
    “I’ve been saying that I don’t think people have to worry about Obama shipping anyone off to concentration camps in cattle cars. ”

    Europeans didn’t either, when they put Hitler in power.

    He was elected because some people thought he would improve their lot by sticking it to those who done them wrong. Others (including conservatives) believed they would be able to keep him on a short leash.

    They were dreadfully, fatally wrong.

    I don’t believe we’re necessarily headed for concentration camps, but I could be wrong. Obama deliberately sought out and apprenticed himself to people who wanted exactly that.

    OTOH Obama’s proposal for an armed civilian security force as large and as well-equipped as the army scares the sh** out of me.

    If it doesn’t scare the sh** out of you too, I suggest you’re not quite the student of history you believe yourself to be.

    Do you think you or I or Tam or sayuncle would be allowed to be part of such a force? I believe its entire purpose would be to keep people like us “in line”.

  8. Sebastian says:

    Well, when you find Obama’s version of “Mein Kampf” I might concede that point. I think vigilance is called for here, but I don’t think we need to panic at this point.

  9. oldblinddog says:

    Sebastion said:

    I agree with Jonah Goldberg’s proposition that our political opponents share intellectual roots with the fascist ideology, but that they are not evil, they are wrong, and dangerously misguided. If Obama puts Bill Ayers or Bernadine Dohrn in charge of his service initiatives, then I might change my mind, but for now, all the evidence points to Obama being a solidly naive progressive, within the framework that they’ve existed within in this country for most of the 20th century. That doesn’t mean our opposition should be any less intense, but we’re not fighting Nazis.

    This is one of many comments that I was refering to in my original comment. Obama may be a “solid progressive” but he is anything but naive.

    You also said (in the post above):

    Turns out Bill Ayers is pretty familiar with Obama after all. You know, I’ve been saying that I don’t think people have to worry about Obama shipping anyone off to concentration camps in cattle cars. I still stand by that, because I think Obama is hiring and appointing solid progressives…

    You don’t need cattle cars when “community service” is mandatory, you will just drive yourself there. You don’t have to be a “nazi” to be a socialist, the wealth will still be spread. Like I said, I don’t think you know what a “solid progressive” is.

  10. Sebastian says:

    Oldblinddog:

    In the European parlance, he’d be a social democrat. Social Democrats have existed in Europe for half a century without systematically murdering anyone. To be sure, I find their ideology revolting, because it is still collectivist, but it’s not murderous. It’s also not socialist, strictly speaking, though it takes some from socialist ideology.

    The problem with Bill Ayers is that however much of a progressive, liberal, or social democrat that Obama is, he pretty clearly doesn’t find Ayers revolting enough to either keep him at arms length, or tell him to take a long walk off a short pier.

  11. oldblinddog says:

    It doesn’t matter how much you try to sugar coat it, calling him a social democrat (or any other label you may want to apply), it doesn’t change what he is or the fact that you fail to comprehend the true nature of the change that is about to take place. Maybe this will help.

  12. Sebastian says:

    I’m well aware we have some nasty shit coming down the pike. I don’t like most of the drivel the democrats are selling. But it’s the same shit they’ve been selling for the last century, at least. If you want to go off and believe a murderous dictatorship is coming, that’s fine. But don’t expect me to come with you. I will continue to oppose this Administration the same way we’ve opposed other administrations: through the political process — until it gives me a reason to do otherwise. So far, it has not given me that reason.

  13. mariner says:

    Sebastian said:
    “Well, when you find Obama’s version of “Mein Kampf” I might concede that point. I think vigilance is called for here, but I don’t think we need to panic at this point.”

    And when you find where I suggested panic, I’ll concede. ;)

  14. oldblinddog says:

    Go off? No, I’m not going anywhere. I intend to do everything within reason to oppose socialism in this country. We don’t have a “murderous dictatorship” yet but history shows that in every instance that socialism had been tried all become murderous dictatorships once they have gained absolute power.

    I find it interesting that the commenters here aren’t the ones that are throwing out the terms nazi, cattle cars, murderous dictatorship, etc. but that you are. Why do you feel it necessary to create a straw man to knock down?

  15. Sebastian says:

    mariner: Fair enough :)

  16. Sebastian says:

    Oldblinddog:

    I was speaking of a post a few days ago where a Georgia Congressman basically said as much. Interstate highways were a Nazi idea too, doesn’t mean they were a bad one, or that the people who proposed the idea were looking to bring National Socialism to America.

    Show me which industries Obama has proposed to nationalize (at least those which Bush has not already nationalized). Where is he advocating the public controlling the means of production? These are some of the essences of socialist ideology.

    I mean, I understand using the term communist and socialist as hyperbole. But what really makes Obama a socialist or Marxist, in terms of what he’s proposed, as opposed to Progressive in the American tradition, or Social Democrat in the European tradition?

    I’ll leave speculation as to whether Obama is really, in his heart, a Marxist. There’s some evidence based on his associations that he may be sympathetic to Marxism. To me this was reason enough to vote against him, and to volunteer an ungodly amount of my time working for his opponent. But that time has passed. And for now, I’m going to give him the benefit of doubt until he gives me a reason to do otherwise.

  17. oldblinddog says:

    I’m not using the term as hyperbole. As far as I am concerned democrat=liberal=progressive=socialist=marxist. And I am not giving any of them the benefit of the doubt.

    It matters not what Bush has done or is doing. It does not make what they are attempting to do alright. He (or Pelosi, Reid, Biden, Clinton, et al) has stated, not in a book but in speeches and on websites, what he intends. If a man says he is going to kill me, I take him at his word. This is no different.

  18. Sebastian says:

    Except that they’re not.

  19. oldblinddog says:

    Yeah, you must be right.

  20. Sebastian says:

    Seriously, how is that different from the Republican=conservative=reactionary=militarist=fascist crap I’ve had to listen to over the past eight years?

  21. oldblinddog says:

    It is different because it is true. However, Republicans are not conservatives and as far as I know most conservatives are far from reactionary. The fascists are, as we have seen, over on the left (you might know that had you been paying attention).

  22. Kathy says:

    Just to play slight devil’s advocate.

    There are people that I don’t know very well that could be considered “family friends” Additionally, sometimes people have different interpretations of the level of friendship that exists between them and another person. *shrugs*

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