Ban on Saiga Shotguns in the Works

Hardly surprised at the timing of this announcement from SHOT. With NRA tied up trying to stop a magazine ban and reeling from the media feeding frenzy after the Arizona tragedy, they won’t have much leftover political capital to get Congress to spank ATF. I think it’s possible for ATF to make a determination that will halt importation, without affecting firearms already in the country and possessed by individuals. There are a large number of Saiga shotguns out there. A friend of mine has one. Generally speaking, of a shotgun is declared to have no sporting purpose, it’s a destructive device by definition. It’s only through the graces of the Attorney General that we are permitted to possess shotguns in higher than .410 gauge at all. The Gun Control Act leaves that matter in the hands of unelected bureaucrats, to determine what is “sporting,” and thus what you may legally own.

UPDATE: Oh, just a reminder, Blue Steem Dems want you to know that Obama is pro-gun. If you believe that, I have some pristine wetlands in Florida I’d like to sell you.

14 thoughts on “Ban on Saiga Shotguns in the Works”

  1. Maybe he’s just trying to encourage growth of a domestic Saiga manufacturer? Job growth, etc. etc.?

  2. there is a very simple fix to this whole problem which im surprised gun rights groups havent gone after- the sporting clause. Its a low hanging fruit that is practically on the ground in constitutional law terms. Here is the entire arguement “since the second amendment as held in heller and in mcdonald is understood to protect firearms that are appropriate for self defense there for its unconstitutional to determine the legality of a firearm soley based on its suitability for sporting”. Boom- there it is- there is no way that the defense could make a credible arguement against this.

  3. I would consider 3-gun competitions a sporting use. Just because you are shooting paper and steel targets instead of ducks does not make it any less sporting.

  4. “But hopefully if Supreme Court Justice Sotomayor joins the majority in favor of incorporating the 2nd Amendment to the states in McDonald v. Chicago when that is argued March 2, 2010 . . .”

    We know how that worked out, don’t we Blue Steel Dems? Obama appointed an anti-gunner. He’s been sneaking around doing what he can against guns without being overtly as anti-gun as he is, so that he can get re-elected. We’re going to expose him in 2012, so that people will see just how anti-gun he has been.
    If ATF makes Saiga shotguns DD’s, which they are not, or even cuts off imports, then their boss will have more hell to pay for it on election day. With the worst economy since the depression that 0bama has presided over, he needs all the help he can get to be re-elected, and he doesn’t need ATF to be a boat anchor dragging his campaign down. Still, a ban on Saiga imports may be the price we have to pay to have a new, pro-gun, president who will overturn that ban.
    Political actions have political costs, and when the NRA gets involved, those costs are high.
    BTW the most “sporting” guns are the full auto ones, since they’re the most fun to fire. ATF has its back on headwards.

  5. I’m with Ginn. I don’t see anything about sporting use in the second amendment.

  6. “Sporting Purposes” is a dead letter after Heller – but it’s really small fry as well. We’re still drawing the outlines – it may not end up being necessary to go after that clause if you can get at the deeper roots of stupid law.

  7. Well, let me clarify – I suspect that Congress has the power to regulate international importation of non-sporting-purpose firearms (and by regulate I mean ban). I don’t see them having the power to regulate/ban the possession or manufacture of non-sporting-purpose firearms inside the US borders.

    I also think it’s a stupid idea.

  8. sebastian,

    I am just as skeptical with fed courts as you are but this is a no brainer. I’m not saying that the saiga will be found constituionally protected but i can’t see anyway the court can let the “sporting purpose clause” stand. It will atleast have to be modified to “sporting and/or slef defense purpose”.

  9. Ginn,

    The courts give extremely wide latitude to the other branches of the government when it comes to foreign intercourse, including trade. The odds of a federal court, including the Supreme Court, telling the president or Congress they can’t do something related to foreign trade is practically nil.

    Firearms laws, as far as imports are concerned, will not be touched by the courts. Our remedy is solely legislative.

    I wouldn’t be too concerned about them becoming DDs. ATF knows how many there are in-country. After the Streetsweeper debacle – an improper amnesty lasting seven years, affecting a few thousand units, and still not getting all of them on paper – they know they’re just going to make their own lives miserable if they do it. Never underestimate laziness as a motivational factor.

  10. There are rumors this maybe about guns other than the Saiga.

    Even if a gun is not importable, that doesn’t at all make it a DD…

    Every pump gun with a tube mag capacity of over 5 rounds isn’t importable under the BS “sporting purpose” test… but they are obviously not considered DDs.

  11. Diomed,

    What you say is true- the courts give congress a wide lattitude when it comes to international trade but i still feel they would find that the sporting clause in its entirety now as unconstitutional. Again, there is almost no way to defend it without just blatantly saying “well we want to keep and we are in charge”.

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