This blogger makes some very salient points about the guy who open carried a gun near an Obama event with a sign saying “It’s Time to Water the Tree of Liberty.”
However, on the subject of what actually took place here, was this man well within his Constitutional right; being he was well within the proper law to carry his gun, the answer to this question is an obvious yes. The second question is and I will answer it; is this. Was it really in the best interests of Conservative, Republicans, and yes, even libertarians and law abiding gun owners for this man to show up at a town-hall meeting where the President of the United States was going to be attending with a Firearm and a sign that says that the Government needs to be overthrown by a violent revolution? I say this as not only Conservative who believes in the right to carry a firearm. But as someone who believes in something, that is not found in this day and age of internet sound bites, called common sense —  I am going to come down on that side and say that this man was totally out of line and should been removed from the area. The reason I say this is because I happen to know that our President is getting more threats on his life now, than when the previous Administration was in power.
I don’t agree that he should have been removed. The Secret Service wouldn’t have been worried, because he was well away from the President. But I absolutely agree that it was a boneheaded move. I saw the segment on Chris Matthews, and agree he did a good job of avoiding Matthews’ trap. Matthews was hoping for foaming at the mouth, and got Libertarian geek instead. I don’t think this guy was ever a threat to the President to the point where the Secret Service would have had to do something, but I agree it’s not the best public face for our movement.
My worry is that a lot of these people are attention seekers, and the fact that he got what he was after might mean more people try a stunt like this. The left is already going ape shit trying to smear us with these guys. The last thing we need is more. If you’re going to a rally or public event, I wouldn’t bemoan anyone carrying, but I think people need to exercise discretion.
Well the left will always smear gun owners no matter what we do.
I don’t see the point in holding back in hopes the Left will stop throwing insult.
Gun Banners lie through there teeth and the news quotes then as gospel.
I think it is worth shouting from rooftops if some people in the middle hear it over the left wing noise.
i think that after the MtnJack fiasco in Beaver County, we are basically required to carry guns to rallies now. it’s either that or we accept that the government can tell us not to exercise our rights because someone might be “offended.”
This isn’t a matter of the government telling you what to do or not. It’s a matter of being a good ambassador for the Second Amendment. There’s a lot of things we might have the right to do, but that doesn’t necessarily mean others, who are not part of the culture, will look on it the same way someone in the culture would.
If we become a quirky subculture, that has no concern or care what others outside our group think, gun rights are finished in this country. You have to control your own narrative, and what guys like this do is allow the left to control our narrative.
So what, to you, would be a good ambassador, hmm? Someone who doesn’t scare the ‘white folks’?
I would suggest that we need to educate the ‘white folks’.
Is our goal to be able to actually engage in a constitutionally protected right? IF that’s the case, we need MORE examples of citizens carrying arms and nothing happening, not less. I carry most every day, and I have not killed anyone yet. You carry, and as far as I know, you haven’t killed anyone either.
Why should I, or anyone else, care if you carry a firearm, if you don’t have any intention of misusing it?
Now, why should I, or anyone else, care if you carry signs that quote one of the founding fathers for Christ’s sake, while carrying a weapon?
And why indeed, should we not demand that our rights, be respected …….. even if some ‘white folks’ get scared?!
You’ve got to push to move the goalposts ….
We’re already a “quirky subculture”.
If this guy got attention, good. He did well on the show with Matthews, as you said. The truth is, that if we lived in a free society and encouraged folks to exercise their rights more often, this would have been a non-story from the get go.
How is this not the best public face for our movement? The way I see it, this guy got on TV, did not come across as a raving lunatic, made some valid points even when Matthews continually spoke over him, all the while not falling into the traps you described above. I think he was a great example of a responsible, thoughtful, slow to anger, gun owner.
The bottom line is that this guy took a risk in getting recognized and got his face, opinions, and thoughts on national TV as a positive example of a gun owner.
I haven’t seen you on a national TV show, Sebastian. And had you been asked to be a guest, I suspect we would have encountered a conservative computer geek who happens to be a gun owner.
I have to agree with Sebastian on this one. I would actually go one further. The sign that he held up could be viewed as a threat in that to water the tree of liberty with the blood of tyrants you kinda have to kill some tyrants. Is it legal to OC in NH walking around with a sign that says “I GONNA KILL SOMEBODY”? I don’t know (IANAL). What I DO know is that perception is reality, and if I (a gun owner/conservative anarchist) can see that this sign might be percieved as a threat I am pretty sure those who are afraid of guns/gun owners might also.
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Packetman:
Because the vast majority of Americans do not carry a firearm on a regular basis. There are what? 3 million permit holders in the entire country? Of those, I’d be surprised if 10% carried on a regular basis. So you have a very small number of people who choose to go about armed. The idea, if you’re going to go the route of promoting firearms being ordinary through open carry, would be to carry under normal circumstances that ordinary people will understand in context. Most people who have never thought about the issue before are going to see a guy armed at an Obama rally, with a sign that vaguely promotes violence against the government, and start to wonder. If there wasn’t a good opportunity to smear the right with the “crazy” label, Chris Matthews never would have had the guy on.
If the guy had just been singled out for having a gun, I would have been much more sympathetic of those circumstances. But he wasn’t just a guy with a gun in a crowd. If you’re going to convince Americans that carrying a gun is normal, the first rule is to act normal. As soon as you have a gun with a sign like that, you’ve stepped outside that box.
I would even argue having that sign with no gun is not the best public face for the movement, but at least then he wouldn’t have also been smearing gun owners.
So are they tyrants then? Because the quote is about patriots shedding their blood and the blood of tyrants in the name of liberty so to feel threatened they’d have to admit to being tyrants.
I think the secret service figured he was harmless (assassins don’t typically show their guns). They have broad enough powers to have detained him if they wanted.
That said, I wouldn’t have done it. I think that says a lot. I’m not supposed to be afraid of my government, my government is supposed to be afraid of me.
Thanks for the link in! :D