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NRA Endorsement of George Allen

Extrano’s alley questions George Allen’s stance on guns based on this bit over at On The Issues. On The Issues is out of date, incomplete, and often misleading, and it is in this case when it comes to Allen’s record on guns. It is true that Allen voted against the PLCAA, as we would have wanted him to, because it ended up with an assault weapons ban renewal attached to it. Some may recall back in 2004 an Amendment to PLCAA was brought up to renew the ban, and served the very important purpose of getting John Kerry on record as supporting renewal. Once that goal was achieved, the bill was killed. Eventually Allen did vote for final passage of the clean bill after the elections in 2005.

On the Issues mentioned that he does not have an absolutist view of gun ownership. I’m aware of very few politicians that do, and any candidate for Senate that was telling me he believed that is probably a liar. Allen’s record on guns has been quite good, as he’s been willing to introduce, sponsor and help move legislation, which isn’t all that common among Senators. I thought his political career was going to be over after the “Macaca” incident, but apparently he’s on a comeback.

6 Responses to “NRA Endorsement of George Allen”

  1. Broken Andy says:

    So what is the absolutist view on gun ownership? That you can carry your gun into a courthouse while sitting as a defendent in a murder trial? That violent felons can have guns?

    I guess I don’t know what the view looks like. But I bet you can’t find a lot of gun owners with an absolutist view much less politicians.

    • Sebastian says:

      No… certainly you won’t. I am more absolutist than most, given that I think the Second Amendment ought to cover machine guns. But even I am not completely absolutist. I think there are circumstances you can remove or restrict a right after due process. I think guns can be prohibited in places where government can provide a reasonable substitution for self-protection, such as in a courthouse or a capitol. But that’s not absolute, is it? Does absolutism require a belief that people can have ordnance? 500lb bombs? MANPADs?

      • Broken Andy says:

        So then is this “George Allen doesn’t support the absolute right” talk just the musings/frustrations of a fringe? That’s how I take it. Or in other words, I find the usefulness of such claims to be about as fruitful as the absolutist talk on the other side of the spectrum.

        • Sebastian says:

          That’s a conclusion that On The Issues came to. I don’t think the folks who put that site together have a very good understanding of each and every issue, which is why I’m skeptical of how they classify votes and positions. And like I said, a lot of what they show is out of date.

          A lot of politicians were much weaker in the knees in the 90s when it came to guns. Now as the population has become more pro-gun, and attitudes are changing, politicians are reflecting those attitudes as well. So a lot of weak kneed types have gotten more solid in the subsequent time since the 1990s.

  2. Dave says:

    it’s not so simple. Sure, George Allen is a better choice than (D) Tim Kaine, but Allen is running against 2 challengers who are both more pro-RKBA than him, possibly 3.

    Allen did practically nothing for repealing the NPS gun ban, until Jim Webb started beating him in the polls. Then, he introduced a bill that went absolutely nowhere. Although he eventually came down on the right side of the so called AWB, it wasn’t easy. It took literally thousands upon thousands of calls, faxes and emails to convince him to do the right thing. Afterwards, he was quite tepid in his reasoning.

    If you want an honest assessment you should probably look to VCDL.

    I have spoken to both Allen and Radtke. Allen offered no specifics on his “support” Radtke offered she would repeal or support repeal of a host of current restrictions. Unequivocally.

    • Harold says:

      And if I remember correctly, take what the VCDL says with a grain of salt.

      Virginia had a nasty problem with an in theory shall issue regime being ignored by the judges in the Northern Virgina (hugging D.C.) and Virgina Beach areas (I heard that if you could spare a few thousand dollars you could appeal and generally get your permit). This was only fixed after the legislature terminated with extreme prejudice the bench career of a judge who’d issued Oliver North’s permit (he after all had a well demonstrated need, e.g. getting on the wrong side of jihadists) and then changing his mind about North being a “suitable person” when he ran for Senator, and then passing a “this time we mean it!” law in the 1990s.

      But while that was a net win for e.g. me, the law stripped the rest of the state’s population of two important rights, it limited them to handguns and forbid concealed carry at any place that served alcohol (note open carry in bars and restaurants and drinking while carrying remained legal).

      To roughly quote someone at a shad planking when Allen was running for Governor, “George Allen looked me in the eye and promised he wouldn’t take any of my gun rights away.”

      The caveat about the VCDL is that as I remember they were a or the major force behind the above 1990s fix and accepted the alcohol spoiler provision as a “compromise” that would be fixed later, where later turned out to be long as a decade and a half (very recent as I recall).

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