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Debate on HR822

It can be watched here. The anti-gun folks in Congress are using NAGR’s opposition in attempt to defeat the bill. Many of them are saying they have never heard from their constituents on the issue. Make sure that’s not the case. Call your member of Congress here.

UPDATE: I really have to wonder all these gun control supporting Democrats, including Carolyn McCarthy (D-NY) and Hank Johnson (D-GA), will be open to “states rights” arguments the next time they come forward with a federal law that restricts firearms. Using “states rights” arguments against HR822 is the height of hypocrisy for these people.

UPDATE: Democrats keep saying we need to concentrate on the economy, and that people keep telling them they want the focus to be on jobs. Funny, the Democrats were never that concerned about people wanting the focus on jobs when they were busy shoving an expensive, job-killing health care monstrosity nobody wanted down all our throats.

UPDATE: The rules under which HR822 will be considered on the floor are being voted on now. Looks like Don Young wants to attach some Coast Guard museum amendment to it. Earmark? Now it looks like the Coast Guard reauthorization is to be attached? I believe these amendments aren’t being voted on right now, we’re just trying to establish which amendments may be considered under the rule.

UPDATE: I think they are considering rules for another bill now. I didn’t quite follow what became of the rule on HR822, because C-SPAN decided to cut out.

UPDATE: Looks like the rules vote will be at 2. The debate on the underlying bill and amendments will be tomorrow.

19 Responses to “Debate on HR822”

  1. Freiheit says:

    Someone call JayG, the rep from MA is blathering on about jobs.

  2. Sterling Archer says:

    I hope Pat Meehan doesn’t listen to our local leaders of the police state. They don’t seem to like ‘822. See how many lies you can spot in this article.

    http://www.delcotimes.com/articles/2011/11/15/news/doc4ec1e509f0400201611561.txt

  3. Dannytheman says:

    Sterling–I hope you read the responses to that article below! All, as of an hour ago, are for HR822 to pass!

  4. Matthew Carberry says:

    The Coast Guard Museum thing might be this.

    http://donyoung.house.gov/News/DocumentSingle.aspx?DocumentID=232053

    Uncle Don bringing home the bacon. =)

    In all seriousness, tying it to some sort of Coast Guard reauthorization, if it can stick, might give it the kind of “dare to veto” status Park Carry got.

    Also, who was the blond behind Sessions? ;)

  5. ann says:

    I have had my chl for over 15 years. This bill that they have is not a good one. I want it left like it is. If people want to carry elect people that will pass this for you. If they pass this hr822 then any new Congress can amend this bill. Till you have no rights if God forbid we get another Demcoratic Congress. As long as the house is Republican and we can get a A pro 2nd Amendment President. Mitt is not it. He wants another Clinton style gun ban he stated it. Newt is really the only one that will protect our rights. He is also the only one that can go toe to toe with Oboma. He was speaker of the house he knows his stuff. HE balanced the budget with a Democratic President.
    if you want better second amendment rights for your state Vote the right people in. This bill is not the answer. It could come back to bite you. WE HAVE ENOUGH GUN OWNERS THAT IF EVERYONE VOTED REPUBLICAN HOUSE SENATE AND PRESIDENT YOUR SECOND AMENTMENT RIGHTS WOULD BE SAFE . And honor would be brought back to Washington. Republicans love America and they don’t bow to Kings. And they don’t say we are sorry for being Americans they are proud of of it.
    nra gal in Texas

    • Sebastian says:

      That another Congress could come along and pass gun control later is never a reason to do nothing. That’s always a possibility. And for the records, the Republican Party is not much better on gun rights than the Democrats. Don’t kid yourself. I’d take a lot of the pro-gun Democrats over some of the “pro-gun” Republicans any day of the week.

      HR822 is based on the 14th Amendment. Congress has the power to do this. It should do this.

  6. ann says:

    I would welcome any comments. Just remeber Democrats want to take your freedom.

    Ann

  7. Sebastian says:

    Eh… I’ve never been that convinced that the Republicans are that much better on freedom issues. Depending on the freedom in question, they may be marginally better than the Democrats.

  8. Alex Europa says:

    Ann,

    I would respectfully disagree and state that you are operating off of false logic. Explain to me why you think that the same anti-gun Congress that would amend this bill to take away our rights wouldn’t do anything if this bill didn’t exist.

    Remember, they passed the assault weapons ban without having HR 822 in place. If they decide that they want to attack our gun rights, they’ll do it regardless. On the contrary, I believe that this bill actually creates a small buffer to protect our 2nd Amendment rights in the event of an anti-2A president or congress.

    Regarding your point about “voting the right people in,” it’s obvious that you’ve never lived in an anti-gun state. Come on out to Hawaii for a few months and then tell me how you feel about that stance. As great as our republic is, there will always be some flaws within the system.

    – Alex

    • Sebastian says:

      I was actually surprised by the fact that Hawaii still seems to have a reasonably healthy shooting culture. I ran into a busy range on Oahu while there, and even saw a few NRA stickers on the Big Island.

      • Alex Europa says:

        It’s a strange place, in regards to guns and self-defense.

        The ranges are always packed because we have so few of them (only 1 outdoor range available to the public) and the hours of operation are so short (12-3 Mon-Fri). But the biggest problem that we face is the same that the NRA faces nationwide: a general lack of interest by gun owners to fight for their rights. Some local pro-2A people that I know say that the problem that Hawaii faces is what they call the “plantation mentality” in reference to the culture that was fostered by the sugarcane and pineapple companies in past decades. I can’t personally comment on that, but I can say that we do have a core group of shooters in The Hawaii Defense Foundation, who recently filed a lawsuit against the State of Hawaii, as well as the Hawaii Rifle Association. We are constantly trying to raise the public’s awareness…but it’s a long, uphill battle.

        – Alex

        PS: Let me know if you plan to head out this way again.

      • Heather from AK says:

        When I took my NRA instructor courses, there was a gentleman from Hawaii who had traveled all the way here to take the classes. Apparently the NRA has been pushing to get more instructors out on the islands (I was told that as of a few years ago, they didn’t have ANY), in order to get more people involved in shooting sports.

        • Bitter says:

          It does help that there’s a staffer in the Foundation that’s got Hawaii connections. :) I also saw pictures of NRA past president Sandy Froman out there, and I believe she was there for the Kona Friends of NRA event. So Hawaii is definitely getting more attention.

    • ann says:

      Think back when they passed the Clinton gun ban. Democrats had the Senate and the Congress and the Presidency. It is a well known fact that Democrats are anti Second Amendment. Ann Richards was a Democratic Governor she stated I will never approve conceal carry as long as I’m Governor and she lost to a Republican and conceal carry was passed in Texas. I do a lot of work for the 2nd Amendment and also I’m active in the Republican party. I will be starting up my webb site soon. I’m in the process of getting the money together for it.
      Ann

  9. Andy B. says:

    I will just offer the argument that at present, virulently anti-gun states like CA aren’t particularly concerned that PA has one of the more liberal shall-issue concealed carry permit laws in the country; so they’re not lobbying the feds to do something to “crack down” on us. If they’re required by the feds to permit PA residents to carry in their state on the strength of our permits, which (lowering to a whisper) require no training or similar prerequisites, they are going to take up the call for “uniformity,” with their own stringent requirements as the model and baseline.

    • Sebastian says:

      I’d be more concerned in that regard if it wasn’t down to approximately 10 or so states that are hysterical on this issue. I’m not unsympathetic to the notion that getting the feds involved here is a bad idea. A few years ago I agreed with it, and was fighting NRA on National Reciprocity.

      But Heller opened up the possibility of the 14th Amendment being used as a justification for doing this, and that’s mostly what I’m interested in now. This would represent Congress recognizing a right-to-carry in some form, even if it’s not ideal. We really want the Supreme Court to open that door… and despite the fact that the Supreme Court should ideally be non-political, we know it is. It’s going to be more reluctant to second guess an elected branch when a carry case comes before it.

      Once we have a right-to-carry that be enforced by the courts, our opponents are going to be considerably limited in how much they can scale it back, or push the other way. I’m not expecting miracles from the Courts, but if they could toss a lot of the really restrictive laws in outlying states, that would be a huge victory.

  10. Alex Europa says:

    Heather, things are getting better out here now. I’m one of maybe 15 (give or take) active NRA instructors out here.

    The Hawaii Defense Foundation and the Hawaii Rifle Assiciation are really pushing to get as many people trained up as possible. A trained public is an informed public.

    – Alex

  11. denton says:

    I watched part of the debate on CSPAN last night. It left me wondering:

    1. Why do most of the Representatives involved seem less informed about gun laws than the average shooting enthusiast?

    2. Is Alcee Hastings really, actually that dumb? OR

    3. Does it not matter, because it is just political theater? OR

    4. Is it not an “OR” question?

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