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	<title>Comments on: Lines in the Sand</title>
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	<link>http://www.pagunblog.com/2009/07/11/lines-in-the-sand/</link>
	<description>The right of the citizens to bear arms in defense of themselves and the State ...</description>
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		<title>By: N.U.G.U.N.</title>
		<link>http://www.pagunblog.com/2009/07/11/lines-in-the-sand/#comment-46148</link>
		<dc:creator>N.U.G.U.N.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Jul 2009 11:01:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/?p=11607#comment-46148</guid>
		<description>Most people do not realize that the founder of Planned Parenthood was a eugenist. And saw it as a solution to the black problem, and other undesirables.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Most people do not realize that the founder of Planned Parenthood was a eugenist. And saw it as a solution to the black problem, and other undesirables.</p>
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		<title>By: Matt Groom</title>
		<link>http://www.pagunblog.com/2009/07/11/lines-in-the-sand/#comment-46045</link>
		<dc:creator>Matt Groom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:04:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/?p=11607#comment-46045</guid>
		<description>My father has a saying that fits this debate:
&quot;Nobody is qualified to do anything until they&#039;ve done it for six months.&quot;
And this is true. You can go to school, get a degree and get a job, but you certainly won&#039;t be able to do it well until you&#039;ve done it for an extended period. This applies to parenthood as well. If you have never been around kids, and maybe don&#039;t even like children, you certainly are not going to be a &quot;natural&quot; when it comes to parenting, no matter how many books you&#039;ve read or family sitcoms you&#039;ve watched. 

No matter what you believe or what anyone tells you, there is only one reason you exist, and that is to have children. If you raise them well, and they grow healthy and prosperous, it increases their chances of having healthy and successful children of their own, thus spreading your successful genes across another generation. Nothing is more important that this. Not the state of the world, not the fairness of government, not your economic status, not your level of education, not your level of religious or spiritual enlightenment, and certainly not your own personal happiness. But short of someone who absolutely cannot have children of their own, the only people who will be able to care for and raise your children is YOU, because you cared enough to stay.

Everything in life has a learning curve, and the very idea that the government should be able to deny someone a natural right because they cannot intuit the perfect form of an act the very first attempt is naive and evil. The reason we do everything we do is so that we can provide for the next generation, whether we know it or not. You do what is good for yourself BECAUSE it is good for your children, even if they have yet to be born.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My father has a saying that fits this debate:<br />
&#8220;Nobody is qualified to do anything until they&#8217;ve done it for six months.&#8221;<br />
And this is true. You can go to school, get a degree and get a job, but you certainly won&#8217;t be able to do it well until you&#8217;ve done it for an extended period. This applies to parenthood as well. If you have never been around kids, and maybe don&#8217;t even like children, you certainly are not going to be a &#8220;natural&#8221; when it comes to parenting, no matter how many books you&#8217;ve read or family sitcoms you&#8217;ve watched. </p>
<p>No matter what you believe or what anyone tells you, there is only one reason you exist, and that is to have children. If you raise them well, and they grow healthy and prosperous, it increases their chances of having healthy and successful children of their own, thus spreading your successful genes across another generation. Nothing is more important that this. Not the state of the world, not the fairness of government, not your economic status, not your level of education, not your level of religious or spiritual enlightenment, and certainly not your own personal happiness. But short of someone who absolutely cannot have children of their own, the only people who will be able to care for and raise your children is YOU, because you cared enough to stay.</p>
<p>Everything in life has a learning curve, and the very idea that the government should be able to deny someone a natural right because they cannot intuit the perfect form of an act the very first attempt is naive and evil. The reason we do everything we do is so that we can provide for the next generation, whether we know it or not. You do what is good for yourself BECAUSE it is good for your children, even if they have yet to be born.</p>
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		<title>By: Alex</title>
		<link>http://www.pagunblog.com/2009/07/11/lines-in-the-sand/#comment-46031</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 13 Jul 2009 04:14:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/?p=11607#comment-46031</guid>
		<description>Bitter:

You make a good point.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bitter:</p>
<p>You make a good point.</p>
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		<title>By: Bitter</title>
		<link>http://www.pagunblog.com/2009/07/11/lines-in-the-sand/#comment-46029</link>
		<dc:creator>Bitter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 13 Jul 2009 03:52:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/?p=11607#comment-46029</guid>
		<description>&lt;em&gt;I just don’t see any problem with what this Science Czar is advocating.&lt;/em&gt;

You mean you support the government forcing pregnancies, as well?  That&#039;s right, read what the man wrote.  It&#039;s not just that he wants to force abortions upon people, but also to give the government complete control over the reproductive decisions of all women.  In fact, he laid out a legal framework to make not having children (or, his primary view, having children) a crime.  You are a little facist if you support this, Alex.  You realize that with your ideal government, there would be no room for guns in private hands, correct?  Proper population control could not happen when a father is willing to kill and die to defend a woman about to give birth to his child.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><em>I just don’t see any problem with what this Science Czar is advocating.</em></p>
<p>You mean you support the government forcing pregnancies, as well?  That&#8217;s right, read what the man wrote.  It&#8217;s not just that he wants to force abortions upon people, but also to give the government complete control over the reproductive decisions of all women.  In fact, he laid out a legal framework to make not having children (or, his primary view, having children) a crime.  You are a little facist if you support this, Alex.  You realize that with your ideal government, there would be no room for guns in private hands, correct?  Proper population control could not happen when a father is willing to kill and die to defend a woman about to give birth to his child.</p>
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		<title>By: Alex</title>
		<link>http://www.pagunblog.com/2009/07/11/lines-in-the-sand/#comment-46026</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 13 Jul 2009 02:23:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/?p=11607#comment-46026</guid>
		<description>Abused children are like time bombs.  Some one abuses/neglects/etc a kid, then that kid grows up, commits crimes of his own, raises his own family, and starts the cycle all over again.  This is not good for society.

If you are a teen mom and you think you&#039;re capable of raising a child to adulthood, then you&#039;re either stupid or delusional, either way, you&#039;re unfit to be a parent.

I don&#039;t get it.  I just don&#039;t see any problem with what this Science Czar is advocating.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Abused children are like time bombs.  Some one abuses/neglects/etc a kid, then that kid grows up, commits crimes of his own, raises his own family, and starts the cycle all over again.  This is not good for society.</p>
<p>If you are a teen mom and you think you&#8217;re capable of raising a child to adulthood, then you&#8217;re either stupid or delusional, either way, you&#8217;re unfit to be a parent.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t get it.  I just don&#8217;t see any problem with what this Science Czar is advocating.</p>
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		<title>By: RAH</title>
		<link>http://www.pagunblog.com/2009/07/11/lines-in-the-sand/#comment-46016</link>
		<dc:creator>RAH</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Jul 2009 20:42:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/?p=11607#comment-46016</guid>
		<description>Biological urges to procreate do not depend on how prosperous or wise the parents are. In  fact if more children are born there is greater odds more children will live to procreate. Parent&#039;s only real posession is their children and they are biologically programmed to defend them, So if a totalitarian idiot  like Alex thinks it would have been a  good idea to steal my children, I have every moral right to kill him.

 i  think that every  mother has that instinct, it is called the mother love to protect her children. Some are deficient and bad mothers but the children if they survive will create more children. That is the meanin of the biological urge to peocreate our species to ensure that more children are created</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Biological urges to procreate do not depend on how prosperous or wise the parents are. In  fact if more children are born there is greater odds more children will live to procreate. Parent&#8217;s only real posession is their children and they are biologically programmed to defend them, So if a totalitarian idiot  like Alex thinks it would have been a  good idea to steal my children, I have every moral right to kill him.</p>
<p> i  think that every  mother has that instinct, it is called the mother love to protect her children. Some are deficient and bad mothers but the children if they survive will create more children. That is the meanin of the biological urge to peocreate our species to ensure that more children are created</p>
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		<title>By: Buck</title>
		<link>http://www.pagunblog.com/2009/07/11/lines-in-the-sand/#comment-46011</link>
		<dc:creator>Buck</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Jul 2009 18:25:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/?p=11607#comment-46011</guid>
		<description>And I know it&#039;s misspelled, typing while after wrist surgery and being motion sick will cause errors.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And I know it&#8217;s misspelled, typing while after wrist surgery and being motion sick will cause errors.</p>
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		<title>By: Buck</title>
		<link>http://www.pagunblog.com/2009/07/11/lines-in-the-sand/#comment-46010</link>
		<dc:creator>Buck</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Jul 2009 18:21:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/?p=11607#comment-46010</guid>
		<description>Alex, what criteria do you use to decide the Palins are bad parents. My guess is no one can meet your standards. I observe parents in my neighborhood who could make more of a effort, but they don&#039;t need their kids taken from them. But by your comments you endorsers a social tyranny that would cause me draw a line in the sand.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Alex, what criteria do you use to decide the Palins are bad parents. My guess is no one can meet your standards. I observe parents in my neighborhood who could make more of a effort, but they don&#8217;t need their kids taken from them. But by your comments you endorsers a social tyranny that would cause me draw a line in the sand.</p>
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		<title>By: jdude</title>
		<link>http://www.pagunblog.com/2009/07/11/lines-in-the-sand/#comment-46003</link>
		<dc:creator>jdude</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Jul 2009 15:54:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/?p=11607#comment-46003</guid>
		<description>What I wrote in one line may be misinterpreted, so allow me to expand here:
replace this sentence:
&quot;In the extreme, such as severe abuse, I’ll agree that force is necessary.&quot;

with this one.
&quot;In the extreme, such as severe abuse, I’ll agree that government or community force is necessary to isolate and protect the child.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What I wrote in one line may be misinterpreted, so allow me to expand here:<br />
replace this sentence:<br />
&#8220;In the extreme, such as severe abuse, I’ll agree that force is necessary.&#8221;</p>
<p>with this one.<br />
&#8220;In the extreme, such as severe abuse, I’ll agree that government or community force is necessary to isolate and protect the child.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: jdude</title>
		<link>http://www.pagunblog.com/2009/07/11/lines-in-the-sand/#comment-46002</link>
		<dc:creator>jdude</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Jul 2009 15:49:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/?p=11607#comment-46002</guid>
		<description>&quot;Yes, I think Bristol’s child should be taken away, at gun point if necessary. That baby deserves a better set of parents; both Tripp and Bristol (and Levi) would greatly benefit from this course of action. Todd would not be justified in shooting the men; that would be doing his daughter and granddaughter a grave disservice.&quot; 

I&#039;ll accept, only for the sake of argument, that the parents depicted are not the best available. Yet I must point out a few things. As far as we can tell, the child is not abused. The parents are not mentally retarded, nor unfit to take care of themselves. Therefore I am interpreting your argument to be &quot;because someone, somewhere, can raise the child better, it is thus proper to force this action.&quot; Since the only difference in the child will only be a few iq points, or a trip to mcdonalds instead of a healty fish and salad meal, I find it entirely proper for the parents to defend with force the taking of their child.

&quot;Depending on the parents, sometimes the best way to defend their progeny is to let better people raise them.&quot; In the extreme, such as severe abuse, I&#039;ll agree that force is necessary. Otherwise the choice must be up to the parents. Not you, me, or anybody else.

In summation, I vehemently disagree with your position.

I am not a parent.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Yes, I think Bristol’s child should be taken away, at gun point if necessary. That baby deserves a better set of parents; both Tripp and Bristol (and Levi) would greatly benefit from this course of action. Todd would not be justified in shooting the men; that would be doing his daughter and granddaughter a grave disservice.&#8221; </p>
<p>I&#8217;ll accept, only for the sake of argument, that the parents depicted are not the best available. Yet I must point out a few things. As far as we can tell, the child is not abused. The parents are not mentally retarded, nor unfit to take care of themselves. Therefore I am interpreting your argument to be &#8220;because someone, somewhere, can raise the child better, it is thus proper to force this action.&#8221; Since the only difference in the child will only be a few iq points, or a trip to mcdonalds instead of a healty fish and salad meal, I find it entirely proper for the parents to defend with force the taking of their child.</p>
<p>&#8220;Depending on the parents, sometimes the best way to defend their progeny is to let better people raise them.&#8221; In the extreme, such as severe abuse, I&#8217;ll agree that force is necessary. Otherwise the choice must be up to the parents. Not you, me, or anybody else.</p>
<p>In summation, I vehemently disagree with your position.</p>
<p>I am not a parent.</p>
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