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	<title>Comments on: NRA Endorsements for Libertarians</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.pagunblog.com/2008/10/22/nra-endorsements-for-libertarians/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.pagunblog.com/2008/10/22/nra-endorsements-for-libertarians/</link>
	<description>The right of the citizens to bear arms in defense of themselves and the State ...</description>
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		<title>By: Sebastian</title>
		<link>http://www.pagunblog.com/2008/10/22/nra-endorsements-for-libertarians/#comment-31869</link>
		<dc:creator>Sebastian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Oct 2008 13:37:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/?p=6038#comment-31869</guid>
		<description>Who&#039;s going to protect the trade routes and trade system from people who want to crap all over it?  Who&#039;s to say if Iran took control over most of the middle eastern oil they wouldn&#039;t prefer to sell it to China and India?  Who&#039;s to say they won&#039;t be charging monopoly prices since they would have a significant portion of the world&#039;s oil production cornered?  What do you do about a resurgent Russia that wants to use energy to blackmail Europe into giving Russia back it&#039;s empire?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Who&#8217;s going to protect the trade routes and trade system from people who want to crap all over it?  Who&#8217;s to say if Iran took control over most of the middle eastern oil they wouldn&#8217;t prefer to sell it to China and India?  Who&#8217;s to say they won&#8217;t be charging monopoly prices since they would have a significant portion of the world&#8217;s oil production cornered?  What do you do about a resurgent Russia that wants to use energy to blackmail Europe into giving Russia back it&#8217;s empire?</p>
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		<title>By: Libertarian Girl</title>
		<link>http://www.pagunblog.com/2008/10/22/nra-endorsements-for-libertarians/#comment-31860</link>
		<dc:creator>Libertarian Girl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Oct 2008 03:46:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/?p=6038#comment-31860</guid>
		<description>Do you really think the Middle East doesn&#039;t want to sell their oil to us?

I didn&#039;t say anything about not trading with other countries, I think we should be doing more of that.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Do you really think the Middle East doesn&#8217;t want to sell their oil to us?</p>
<p>I didn&#8217;t say anything about not trading with other countries, I think we should be doing more of that.</p>
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		<title>By: Sebastian</title>
		<link>http://www.pagunblog.com/2008/10/22/nra-endorsements-for-libertarians/#comment-31857</link>
		<dc:creator>Sebastian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Oct 2008 02:19:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/?p=6038#comment-31857</guid>
		<description>Try running a modern industrial economy without oil flowing out of the middle east freely.  We don&#039;t live in a world where we can just concern ourselves with our borders and ignore what goes on in the rest of the world.  Our economies are dependent on trade, and we no longer have the Royal Navy to keep the world safe for commerce.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Try running a modern industrial economy without oil flowing out of the middle east freely.  We don&#8217;t live in a world where we can just concern ourselves with our borders and ignore what goes on in the rest of the world.  Our economies are dependent on trade, and we no longer have the Royal Navy to keep the world safe for commerce.</p>
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		<title>By: Libertarian Girl</title>
		<link>http://www.pagunblog.com/2008/10/22/nra-endorsements-for-libertarians/#comment-31852</link>
		<dc:creator>Libertarian Girl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Oct 2008 00:19:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/?p=6038#comment-31852</guid>
		<description>I hadn&#039;t heard that the NRA is endorsing Perdue over McCrory for NC governor. That would be a surprise. I can&#039;t find any article about this, either.

This is also another gun owner who will be casting a vote for Bob Barr (and Pat McCrory, whether he has the NRA&#039;s endorsement or not).

Personally, I think the &quot;Libertarian isolationist foreign policy&quot;-- in other words, don&#039;t attack someone unless they attacked you first-- should appeal to gun owners. Isn&#039;t that one of the main reasons people own guns?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I hadn&#8217;t heard that the NRA is endorsing Perdue over McCrory for NC governor. That would be a surprise. I can&#8217;t find any article about this, either.</p>
<p>This is also another gun owner who will be casting a vote for Bob Barr (and Pat McCrory, whether he has the NRA&#8217;s endorsement or not).</p>
<p>Personally, I think the &#8220;Libertarian isolationist foreign policy&#8221;&#8211; in other words, don&#8217;t attack someone unless they attacked you first&#8211; should appeal to gun owners. Isn&#8217;t that one of the main reasons people own guns?</p>
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		<title>By: Joe Huffman</title>
		<link>http://www.pagunblog.com/2008/10/22/nra-endorsements-for-libertarians/#comment-31823</link>
		<dc:creator>Joe Huffman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Oct 2008 13:41:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/?p=6038#comment-31823</guid>
		<description>When voting for President in Idaho it&#039;s safe to vote Libertarian this year. Idaho typically goes 70% Republican. By voting Libertarian one can send a message to both the Democrats and Republicans that there are votes to be picked up by adjusting their policies in the Libertarian direction.

As much as I like the Libertarian philosophy they lost me after 9/11. They are wrong about how to deal with the Islamic extremists. So I&#039;ll be voting for Palin (and McCain) this year. And to give my vote a little more importance I&#039;ll be voting in Washington State this year.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>When voting for President in Idaho it&#8217;s safe to vote Libertarian this year. Idaho typically goes 70% Republican. By voting Libertarian one can send a message to both the Democrats and Republicans that there are votes to be picked up by adjusting their policies in the Libertarian direction.</p>
<p>As much as I like the Libertarian philosophy they lost me after 9/11. They are wrong about how to deal with the Islamic extremists. So I&#8217;ll be voting for Palin (and McCain) this year. And to give my vote a little more importance I&#8217;ll be voting in Washington State this year.</p>
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		<title>By: Xrlq</title>
		<link>http://www.pagunblog.com/2008/10/22/nra-endorsements-for-libertarians/#comment-31814</link>
		<dc:creator>Xrlq</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Oct 2008 01:17:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/?p=6038#comment-31814</guid>
		<description>Here in NC, the NRA is endorsing Bev Perdue for governor and Roy Cooper for AG, Democrats both.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Here in NC, the NRA is endorsing Bev Perdue for governor and Roy Cooper for AG, Democrats both.</p>
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		<title>By: Sebastian</title>
		<link>http://www.pagunblog.com/2008/10/22/nra-endorsements-for-libertarians/#comment-31799</link>
		<dc:creator>Sebastian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 22 Oct 2008 20:13:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/?p=6038#comment-31799</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;Not to mention the Libertarian isolationist forign policy pisses off the military pro-gun crowd.&lt;/i&gt;

There is a lot of overlap in the gun issue with National Greatness conservatism.  It&#039;s a message that resonates with a lot of gun owners.  As an interesting experiment, I put out at the last gun show &quot;Veterans for McCain&quot; &quot;Sportsmen for McCain&quot; and &quot;McCain/Palin&quot;.  The Veterans bumper stickers went faster than the sportsmen stickers.  That says that quite a number of gun owners prefer to self-identify as veterans, or at least in terms of their support of McCain, identify with him as veterans.  Not too surprising.

But I&#039;ve talked to people who lament abortion and gay marriage as issues.  People who pretty clearly are a lot more conservative than I am.  A few have talked about wanting to see these Wall Street thieves taken out back and shot; not a statement supportive of economic libertarianism, I would say.  

It&#039;s actually been a real eye opener about exactly what kind of people are the ones we&#039;re trying to reach, and the kinds of people that support John McCain.  It&#039;s at the same time encouraging, discouraging, and sometimes frightening, to see what the gun vote is really made up of.  The real answer is ordinary Americans, with a lot of different opinions.  You get a new appreciations for why politicians speak in platitudes -- it&#039;s just easy to say something that&#039;s going to alienate a certain demographic.  If you took everyone at all the shows, clubs, and various other places I&#039;ve spoken with, and put them in a room and tell them to come up with a platform they could all live with, it would probably look a lot like McCain&#039;s platform.  It&#039;s not perfect, but this is politics.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>Not to mention the Libertarian isolationist forign policy pisses off the military pro-gun crowd.</i></p>
<p>There is a lot of overlap in the gun issue with National Greatness conservatism.  It&#8217;s a message that resonates with a lot of gun owners.  As an interesting experiment, I put out at the last gun show &#8220;Veterans for McCain&#8221; &#8220;Sportsmen for McCain&#8221; and &#8220;McCain/Palin&#8221;.  The Veterans bumper stickers went faster than the sportsmen stickers.  That says that quite a number of gun owners prefer to self-identify as veterans, or at least in terms of their support of McCain, identify with him as veterans.  Not too surprising.</p>
<p>But I&#8217;ve talked to people who lament abortion and gay marriage as issues.  People who pretty clearly are a lot more conservative than I am.  A few have talked about wanting to see these Wall Street thieves taken out back and shot; not a statement supportive of economic libertarianism, I would say.  </p>
<p>It&#8217;s actually been a real eye opener about exactly what kind of people are the ones we&#8217;re trying to reach, and the kinds of people that support John McCain.  It&#8217;s at the same time encouraging, discouraging, and sometimes frightening, to see what the gun vote is really made up of.  The real answer is ordinary Americans, with a lot of different opinions.  You get a new appreciations for why politicians speak in platitudes &#8212; it&#8217;s just easy to say something that&#8217;s going to alienate a certain demographic.  If you took everyone at all the shows, clubs, and various other places I&#8217;ve spoken with, and put them in a room and tell them to come up with a platform they could all live with, it would probably look a lot like McCain&#8217;s platform.  It&#8217;s not perfect, but this is politics.</p>
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		<title>By: Stormy Dragon</title>
		<link>http://www.pagunblog.com/2008/10/22/nra-endorsements-for-libertarians/#comment-31797</link>
		<dc:creator>Stormy Dragon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 22 Oct 2008 20:02:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/?p=6038#comment-31797</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m voting for Bob Barr, so now you know one gun owner voting for him.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m voting for Bob Barr, so now you know one gun owner voting for him.</p>
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		<title>By: nick</title>
		<link>http://www.pagunblog.com/2008/10/22/nra-endorsements-for-libertarians/#comment-31795</link>
		<dc:creator>nick</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 22 Oct 2008 18:35:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/?p=6038#comment-31795</guid>
		<description>&quot;maximizing your political influence is the number one goal.  Ideological concerns take a back seat to that.&quot;

That sums it up nicely.  So what happens when your group becomes very influential in creating policies in conflict with your ideologies?  Oops.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;maximizing your political influence is the number one goal.  Ideological concerns take a back seat to that.&#8221;</p>
<p>That sums it up nicely.  So what happens when your group becomes very influential in creating policies in conflict with your ideologies?  Oops.</p>
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		<title>By: the pistolero</title>
		<link>http://www.pagunblog.com/2008/10/22/nra-endorsements-for-libertarians/#comment-31794</link>
		<dc:creator>the pistolero</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 22 Oct 2008 18:22:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/?p=6038#comment-31794</guid>
		<description>Points taken, but as for Bob Barr, I hope most would see see him as the bandwagon ride-hitcher that he is.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Points taken, but as for Bob Barr, I hope most would see see him as the bandwagon ride-hitcher that he is.</p>
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