Comments on: Is It Wrong to Criticize Good Intentions? http://www.pagunblog.com/2008/09/03/is-it-wrong-to-criticize-good-intentions/ The right of the citizens to bear arms in defense of themselves and the State ... Fri, 10 Feb 2012 09:18:08 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: DirtCrashr http://www.pagunblog.com/2008/09/03/is-it-wrong-to-criticize-good-intentions/#comment-29288 DirtCrashr Wed, 03 Sep 2008 22:25:07 +0000 http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/?p=5026#comment-29288 To me it seems pretty apparent that, given the literature and attitude, they are effective at self-selecting the kind of people who will endure and benefit - and that includes newbies who like to use pain to determine their personal thresholds. OTOH at my club, starting at 8:00AM first Saturday of every month we bring in and have newbies hitting an SR-C 200-yard target at 200 yards from prone with a club M1 Garand - and a lot of them often hit the 7-inch 10-ring or better. It's over by about 1:00 before the real heat of the day catches you, and we do it rain or shine without rhetoric or dressing up in cammo. In my experience the guys to whom this appeals in the first place are self-selecting 2A advocates and don't need the rhetoric - that part's instinctual already. To me it seems pretty apparent that, given the literature and attitude, they are effective at self-selecting the kind of people who will endure and benefit – and that includes newbies who like to use pain to determine their personal thresholds.

OTOH at my club, starting at 8:00AM first Saturday of every month we bring in and have newbies hitting an SR-C 200-yard target at 200 yards from prone with a club M1 Garand – and a lot of them often hit the 7-inch 10-ring or better. It’s over by about 1:00 before the real heat of the day catches you, and we do it rain or shine without rhetoric or dressing up in cammo. In my experience the guys to whom this appeals in the first place are self-selecting 2A advocates and don’t need the rhetoric – that part’s instinctual already.

]]> By: Ninth Stage http://www.pagunblog.com/2008/09/03/is-it-wrong-to-criticize-good-intentions/#comment-29287 Ninth Stage Wed, 03 Sep 2008 22:10:04 +0000 http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/?p=5026#comment-29287 "Is It Wrong to Criticize Good Intentions?" Is it wrong to criticize the paving stones on the road to hell? Or on the road a Marxist worker's paradise (same thing really)? “Is It Wrong to Criticize Good Intentions?” Is it wrong to criticize the paving stones on the road to hell? Or on the road a Marxist worker’s paradise (same thing really)?

]]> By: Jeff http://www.pagunblog.com/2008/09/03/is-it-wrong-to-criticize-good-intentions/#comment-29283 Jeff Wed, 03 Sep 2008 20:07:07 +0000 http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/?p=5026#comment-29283 At the Appleseeds I've attended, the instructors solicited criticism and advice. I think the question of who Appleseed is right for is not one of experience, but one of attitude. Is it a good program for fence sitters who aren't really sure about trying this shooting stuff? In my opinion it isn't. Is it a good program for people like me who have been pro-2A and pro-liberty for a long time, but haven't had the opportunity to learn to shoot? Absolutely. I think the idea of signing up for two solid days of instruction steers away the people who the program isn't right for. If you're willing to give up your whole weekend to go learn to shoot, I think Appleseed is a great fit. At the Appleseeds I’ve attended, the instructors solicited criticism and advice. I think the question of who Appleseed is right for is not one of experience, but one of attitude. Is it a good program for fence sitters who aren’t really sure about trying this shooting stuff? In my opinion it isn’t. Is it a good program for people like me who have been pro-2A and pro-liberty for a long time, but haven’t had the opportunity to learn to shoot? Absolutely.

I think the idea of signing up for two solid days of instruction steers away the people who the program isn’t right for. If you’re willing to give up your whole weekend to go learn to shoot, I think Appleseed is a great fit.

]]> By: Sebastian http://www.pagunblog.com/2008/09/03/is-it-wrong-to-criticize-good-intentions/#comment-29282 Sebastian Wed, 03 Sep 2008 20:03:44 +0000 http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/?p=5026#comment-29282 In order for it to be more honest feedback, it needs to be anonymous, and needs to go to the national organization. Most people aren't going to pipe up with suggestions, especially newbie and novice shooters. If they are asked by the instructors, it's certainly going to be positive, even if that's not really how they feel. In order for it to be more honest feedback, it needs to be anonymous, and needs to go to the national organization. Most people aren’t going to pipe up with suggestions, especially newbie and novice shooters. If they are asked by the instructors, it’s certainly going to be positive, even if that’s not really how they feel.

]]> By: RDB http://www.pagunblog.com/2008/09/03/is-it-wrong-to-criticize-good-intentions/#comment-29281 RDB Wed, 03 Sep 2008 19:58:32 +0000 http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/?p=5026#comment-29281 At both of the shoots I attended, the level of experience ranged from "the bullet comes out that end, right? to; if things go south, I want him watching my back". The instructors at both spent a great deal of time with the most inexperienced shooters. I was close to several and saw the improvement on their targets over time. As was said in the previous thread, you will get out of it what you put in. A basic skill level would allow any student to learn the most from a pretty intensive few hours. One thing I reall liked about the shoots was that there wasn't any attempt to split people up into different classes. We were all in it together. I think that is an excellent compliment to the history portion of the class. I can understand how some people wouldn't like that aspect, but they have other more competitive places to shoot. I didn't have any formal surveys but the instructors were very open about suggestions for improvements. From attending way too many seminars of various types, I personaly don't have much faith in that kind of method anyway. One on one discussions will be much more effective. At both of the shoots I attended, the level of experience ranged from “the bullet comes out that end, right? to; if things go south, I want him watching my back”.

The instructors at both spent a great deal of time with the most inexperienced shooters. I was close to several and saw the improvement on their targets over time. As was said in the previous thread, you will get out of it what you put in. A basic skill level would allow any student to learn the most from a pretty intensive few hours. One thing I reall liked about the shoots was that there wasn’t any attempt to split people up into different classes. We were all in it together. I think that is an excellent compliment to the history portion of the class. I can understand how some people wouldn’t like that aspect, but they have other more competitive places to shoot.

I didn’t have any formal surveys but the instructors were very open about suggestions for improvements. From attending way too many seminars of various types, I personaly don’t have much faith in that kind of method anyway. One on one discussions will be much more effective.

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