Comments on: PSH About Workplace Violence http://www.pagunblog.com/2008/04/25/psh-about-workplace-violence/ The right of the citizens to bear arms in defense of themselves and the State ... Fri, 10 Feb 2012 05:54:30 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Another Flawed Gun Crime Study « Firearms & Freedom http://www.pagunblog.com/2008/04/25/psh-about-workplace-violence/#comment-22126 Another Flawed Gun Crime Study « Firearms & Freedom Sun, 27 Apr 2008 06:23:33 +0000 http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/?p=3322#comment-22126 [...] Hat tip Snowflakes in Hell [...] [...] Hat tip Snowflakes in Hell [...]

]]> By: Peter http://www.pagunblog.com/2008/04/25/psh-about-workplace-violence/#comment-22114 Peter Sat, 26 Apr 2008 21:49:47 +0000 http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/?p=3322#comment-22114 Jim already beat me to most of this, but even with the similar businesses they used as control, the study is going to be skewed. A convenience store in a rough neighborhood is more likely to be held up than one on the nicer side of town, and BECAUSE of that, they are more likely to permit employees to carry, or even leave a gun behind the counter, while the other store doesn't want to "offend" or scare the more upscale customers (which would only happen if the person carrying was careless anyways). Which one is more likely to experience a workplace homicide? That's right, the one in the dangerous area. Jim already beat me to most of this, but even with the similar businesses they used as control, the study is going to be skewed. A convenience store in a rough neighborhood is more likely to be held up than one on the nicer side of town, and BECAUSE of that, they are more likely to permit employees to carry, or even leave a gun behind the counter, while the other store doesn’t want to “offend” or scare the more upscale customers (which would only happen if the person carrying was careless anyways). Which one is more likely to experience a workplace homicide? That’s right, the one in the dangerous area.

]]> By: Jim W http://www.pagunblog.com/2008/04/25/psh-about-workplace-violence/#comment-22109 Jim W Sat, 26 Apr 2008 16:01:36 +0000 http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/?p=3322#comment-22109 I bet the reasons for the correlation are the same sort of reverse causation that Kellermann admitted in his study- that the workplaces that currently allow guns are already at risk from violent criminals so the employees need guns for protection. Most workplace gun violence is in the category of armed robberies at convenience stores and similar. People "going postal" is supremely rare despite news reports suggesting otherwise. Also, even though guns are currently forbidden by many employers here in FL, every place I have worked here had lots of people that carried anyway. Myself included. At most places, everyone knew about it and approved except the company lawyers and probably the insurance company. I remember the last place I worked had a very gun-phobic HR VP who accidentally stumbled upon evidence of the vibrant gun culture in his company. He gave stern warnings to not do it again and then quietly forgot it ever happened. I bet the reasons for the correlation are the same sort of reverse causation that Kellermann admitted in his study- that the workplaces that currently allow guns are already at risk from violent criminals so the employees need guns for protection.

Most workplace gun violence is in the category of armed robberies at convenience stores and similar. People “going postal” is supremely rare despite news reports suggesting otherwise.

Also, even though guns are currently forbidden by many employers here in FL, every place I have worked here had lots of people that carried anyway. Myself included. At most places, everyone knew about it and approved except the company lawyers and probably the insurance company.

I remember the last place I worked had a very gun-phobic HR VP who accidentally stumbled upon evidence of the vibrant gun culture in his company. He gave stern warnings to not do it again and then quietly forgot it ever happened.

]]> By: mark http://www.pagunblog.com/2008/04/25/psh-about-workplace-violence/#comment-22103 mark Sat, 26 Apr 2008 13:44:52 +0000 http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/?p=3322#comment-22103 I retired last spring from a civil service job in PA. We were regularly "reminded" that our parked cars could be searched at will and at random by security officers, and that any of the prohibited items-including guns- were cause for instant firing, including loss of pension and benefits and possible criminal charges. Also, those refusing to "voluntarily" allow searches were presumed guilty, with similar penalties. Still, many I knew carried guns to work every day, some even carried them inside the various buildings. Also, FWIW, each time my License to Carry a Firearm was renewed, my employer was notified by the county sheriff, and I was personally "reminded" of these policies by a HR type. I assume this was the case with all license holders, but it may just have been the chosen few. mark I retired last spring from a civil service job in PA. We were regularly “reminded” that our parked cars could be searched at will and at random by security officers, and that any of the prohibited items-including guns- were cause for instant firing, including loss of pension and benefits and possible criminal charges. Also, those refusing to “voluntarily” allow searches were presumed guilty, with similar penalties.
Still, many I knew carried guns to work every day, some even carried them inside the various buildings.
Also, FWIW, each time my License to Carry a Firearm was renewed, my employer was notified by the county sheriff, and I was personally “reminded” of these policies by a HR type. I assume this was the case with all license holders, but it may just have been the chosen few.

mark

]]> By: mark http://www.pagunblog.com/2008/04/25/psh-about-workplace-violence/#comment-22102 mark Sat, 26 Apr 2008 13:44:33 +0000 http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/?p=3322#comment-22102 I retired last spring from a civil service job in PA. We were regularly "reminded" that our parked cars could be searched at will and at random by security officers, and that any of the prohibited items-including guns- were cause for instant firing, including loss of pension and benefits and possible criminal charges. Also, those refusing to "voluntarily" allow searches were presumed guilty, with similar penalties. Still, many I knew carried guns to work every day, some even carried them inside the various buildings. Also, FWIW, each time my License to Carry a Firearm was renewed, my employer was notified by the county sheriff, and I was personally "reminded" of these policies by a HR type. I assume this was the case with all license holders, but it may just have been the chosen few. mar I retired last spring from a civil service job in PA. We were regularly “reminded” that our parked cars could be searched at will and at random by security officers, and that any of the prohibited items-including guns- were cause for instant firing, including loss of pension and benefits and possible criminal charges. Also, those refusing to “voluntarily” allow searches were presumed guilty, with similar penalties.
Still, many I knew carried guns to work every day, some even carried them inside the various buildings.
Also, FWIW, each time my License to Carry a Firearm was renewed, my employer was notified by the county sheriff, and I was personally “reminded” of these policies by a HR type. I assume this was the case with all license holders, but it may just have been the chosen few.

mar

]]> By: Weer'd Beard http://www.pagunblog.com/2008/04/25/psh-about-workplace-violence/#comment-22094 Weer'd Beard Sat, 26 Apr 2008 09:27:07 +0000 http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/?p=3322#comment-22094 Do derranged and disgruntled sociopaths wake up in the morning, load up the AK-47, and then think “Oh, but damn, the employee handbook says I can’t.” Heh I thought of: "Oh wait, I could posthumously be fired! Do derranged and disgruntled sociopaths wake up in the morning, load up the AK-47, and then think “Oh, but damn, the employee handbook says I can’t.”

Heh I thought of:
“Oh wait, I could posthumously be fired!

]]> By: ironpacker http://www.pagunblog.com/2008/04/25/psh-about-workplace-violence/#comment-22091 ironpacker Sat, 26 Apr 2008 06:01:20 +0000 http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/?p=3322#comment-22091 I think these workplaces all had soap dispensers in the restrooms too. So are employees who wash their hands after using the toilet more likely to committ a crime? (sarcasm off.) I think these workplaces all had soap dispensers in the restrooms too. So are employees who wash their hands after using the toilet more likely to committ a crime? (sarcasm off.)

]]> By: Sebastian http://www.pagunblog.com/2008/04/25/psh-about-workplace-violence/#comment-22085 Sebastian Sat, 26 Apr 2008 02:44:51 +0000 http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/?p=3322#comment-22085 Fixed. Didn't mean to suggest violence against the more tastefully decorating among us. Fixed. Didn’t mean to suggest violence against the more tastefully decorating among us.

]]> By: Sigivald http://www.pagunblog.com/2008/04/25/psh-about-workplace-violence/#comment-22081 Sigivald Fri, 25 Apr 2008 23:36:54 +0000 http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/?p=3322#comment-22081 Allow me to gently suggest that you mean "homicide". Homocide has a rather different suggestion to it, despite being reasonable given the Greek root. Allow me to gently suggest that you mean “homicide”.

Homocide has a rather different suggestion to it, despite being reasonable given the Greek root.

]]> By: Billll http://www.pagunblog.com/2008/04/25/psh-about-workplace-violence/#comment-22080 Billll Fri, 25 Apr 2008 23:33:07 +0000 http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/?p=3322#comment-22080 I seem to remember this study too. Think about the type of workplaces where all those implements of destruction, which according to the paper included knives, pepper and other sprays, guns, etc, might plausibly be found. The first place that pops to mind is a police cruiser, and said "workplace" frequently finds itself in some fairly tacky "work environments". Sure enough, the police were included in the study, and whaddya know, there was "workplace violence" involved. This from my recollection of the study when it came out. Sorry, no link. I seem to remember this study too. Think about the type of workplaces where all those implements of destruction, which according to the paper included knives, pepper and other sprays, guns, etc, might plausibly be found.
The first place that pops to mind is a police cruiser, and said “workplace” frequently finds itself in some fairly tacky “work environments”.
Sure enough, the police were included in the study, and whaddya know, there was “workplace violence” involved.

This from my recollection of the study when it came out. Sorry, no link.

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